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New Novell Evidentiary Objections to SCO's May 18 Filings and Exhibits - Updated
Saturday, June 09 2007 @ 02:18 PM EDT

Well, here we go again. Novell now accuses SCO of trying to smuggle in some evidence and expert reports after the deadline in the Novell case too. That gives you the tone in this extraordinary filing, Novell's Evidentiary Objections to SCO's Exhibits Submitted in Support of its Summary Judgment Oppositions Filed May 18, 2007 [PDF]. (Exhibit A, Part 1; Exhibit A, Part 2; Exhibit A, Part 3; Exhibit A, Part 4, all PDFs.)

It's a smoker, and untimeliness and withheld discovery are not the only issues Novell raises. These are not the same evidentiary objections list we saw earlier, although there is some duplication in types of violations listed. The first list had only five items taken from the Federal Rules of Evidence. This is a new collection, outlining new and additional violations, from Novell's perspective, of materials in SCO memoranda in opposition and in exhibits attached to those documents that SCO filed on May 18. These were sealed exhibits for the most part, but as usual, we find out a bit about what they were anyway.

Novell's introduction says it objects to SCO's evidence in its May 18, 2007 opposition briefs and asks the court "to strike and disregard for all purposes" that evidence, based on ten, count them, ten grounds:

  • relevance (including inadmissible parol evidence)
  • lack of personal knowledge
  • hearsay
  • the best evidence rule
  • improper expert opinion
  • improper use of SCO v. IBM deposition testimony
  • improper authentication
  • untimeliness
  • improper use of settlement evidence, and
  • improper use of withheld discovery

I've marked the new grounds for which Novell would like this evidence stricken, and let's take a look at them in more detail. It's quite a list.

Novell is telling the court that not only is SCO violating evidentiary rules like the parol evidence and hearsay rules it mentioned last time, in addition Novell accuses SCO of new types of misbehavior. Novell therefore asks the court to toss out a long list of sealed exhibits attached to the Declaration of Mark James, number 298 on Pacer: Exhibits 10, 11, 17, 18, 12, 13, 19, 20, 21, 22, 6, 15, 33, 34, 37, 7, 14, 26, and 66, as well as Exhibits 30 and 32, "newly-cited" but not attached. That includes the declarations of R. Duff Thompson, Doug Michels, Ed Chatlos, Jim Wilt, Kim Madsen, William Broderick, John Maciaszek, Darl McBride (11/10/06 version), and Jay Petersen, as well as Maureen O'Gara's deposition transcript and the deposition transcripts of Burt Levine, Alok Mohan, Robert Frankenberg, Thompson, Michels, Chatlos, Wilt, Madsen, and Broderick.

Is that not pretty much the entire kit and kaboodle? No, there is much more, as I'll show you. I don't know why SCO would try some of the same tricks it was sanctioned for by the same court, same judge, in IBM, since it seems counterproductive. But there you are. Maybe it's like dancing. Some folks can waltz, but they can't tango. So whatever music is playing -- tango, two-step, salsa, or waltz -- you'll find them waltzing around the room again.

I know some of you are saying, "It is about time somebody told the court what they do." You may hope that the penalty is that the lawyers are marched out and shot at dawn. No. Nothing like that happens. But there certainly can be a penalty. What the penalty can be is that you don't get to use the evidence, because of your improper conduct, and that can mean you lose your motion or your case. Whether that will happen here is impossible to say, but it happened to SCO in the IBM litigation (of course they are trying to get the court to reverse it), and it's the same judges. Even if not everything on Novell's list gets the judge's agreement, it surely will get his attention.

The SCO briefs that are affected, or would be, if the judge accepts Novell's point of view are:

  • SCO's Memorandum in Opposition to Novell's Motion for Summary Judgment on SCO's First and Third Claims for Relief
  • SCO's Memorandum in Opposition to Novell's Motion for Partial Summary Judgment on SCO's Non-Compete Claim in its Second and Fifth Claims for Relief
  • SCO's Memorandum in Opposition to Novell's Motion for Summary Judgment on SCO's First Claim for Slander of Title Based on Failure to Establish Special Damages
  • SCO's Memorandum in Opposition to Novell's Motion for Partial Summary Judgment on the Copyright Ownership Portions of SCO's Second and Fifth Claims for Relief

The SCO filings and exhibits with these filings are all listed on the docket as numbers 299 through 320. Let's take a look at what Novell says SCO shouldn't be allowed to use and why.

Improper Expert Opinion

My personal favorite. I was wondering if someone would raise this. Novell lays out the Federal Rule of Evidence that applies, 702, which basically says an expert can't just guess or go off on tangents and must use reliable principles and methods so his or her testimony is based on something reliable and is related to the facts of the case:

Rule 702. Testimony by Experts

If scientific, technical, or other specialized knowledge will assist the trier of fact to understand the evidence or to determine a fact in issue, a witness qualified as an expert by knowledge, skill, experience, training, or education, may testify thereto in the form of an opinion or otherwise, if (1) the testimony is based upon sufficient facts or data, (2) the testimony is the product of reliable principles and methods, and (3) the witness has applied the principles and methods reliably to the facts of the case.

Furthermore, Rule 56(e) says that experts must do more than present admissible facts, since they are not fact witnesses:

(e) Form of Affidavits; Further Testimony; Defense Required.

Supporting and opposing affidavits shall be made on personal knowledge, shall set forth such facts as would be admissible in evidence, and shall show affirmatively that the affiant is competent to testify to the matters stated therein. Sworn or certified copies of all papers or parts thereof referred to in an affidavit shall be attached thereto or served therewith. The court may permit affidavits to be supplemented or opposed by depositions, answers to interrogatories, or further affidavits. When a motion for summary judgment is made and supported as provided in this rule, an adverse party may not rest upon the mere allegations or denials of the adverse party's pleading, but the adverse party's response, by affidavits or as otherwise provided in this rule, must set forth specific facts showing that there is a genuine issue for trial. If the adverse party does not so respond, summary judgment, if appropriate, shall be entered against the adverse party.

You have to establish, then, that your expert is qualified to testify to the matter addressed. Experts are expected to stand on a firm foundation but one that others can look at. They can't just say, "It's my expert opinion that the moon is made of blue cheese. It is true, because I say so and I'm an expert." After all, since Biblical times, it has been possible to hire false witnesses in court disputes to lie, so the rules require that experts show how they reached a conclusion, so the value of what they say can be tested. One case Novell quotes puts it this way:

It will not do to say that it must all be left to the skill of experts. Expertise is a rational process and a rational process implies expressed reasons for judgment. An opinion has a significance proportioned to the sources that sustain it. An expert who supplies nothing but a bottom line supplies nothing of value to the judicial process. See Richardson v. Richardson-Merrell, Inc., ... holding that an expert's declaration, full of assertion but empty of facts and reasons, won't get a case past a motion for summary judgment, for the judge must "look behind [the expert's] ultimate conclusion ... and analyze the adequacy of its foundation." Mid-State Fertilizer Co. v. Exchange Nat'l Bank.

As for SCO's experts in this case, Novell says this:

Here, the expert testimony offered by SCO's witnesses is not based on sufficient facts or data, employs the wrong method, and does not apply the method reliably to the facts of this case. In addition, the expert reports of Evan Ivie and Thomas Cargill are not even from the current litigation, but from SCO v. IBM to which Novell is not a party. They are therefore improper in this case.

As for Gary Pisano, Novell says bluntly, "Mr. Pisano is not qualified as an expert, and his proffered testimony lacks the requisite foundation for admissibility on summary judgment." That doesn't, by the way, mean he couldn't become qualified; I believe Novell is saying SCO failed to take the proper procedural steps to qualify him to serve in a legal sense as an expert in this particular case. Paul Moxley also "is not qualified as an expert in this matter," Novell says, and "his testimony is inadmissible hearsay". Ditto Christine Botosan. In any case, SCO is too late with these experts reports, even if they did qualify as experts in these matters. You'll recall Novell has also filed a motion to strike a Mark James Supplemental Declaration, with two new expert reports attached, filed on May 30 (due May 18) and Novell wrote:

The James Declaration attaches over 60 pages of expert reports from Christine Botosan and Gary Pisano to which Novell has not had any opportunity to respond. SCO provided no warning to Novell that it would be submitting this new evidence on the eve of the hearing, and has not provided any excuse for why the expert reports were not filed along with its May 18th opposition papers. Indeed, SCO did submit conclusory declarations from Drs. Pisano and Botosan with its original opposition papers.

I'm guessing that SCO filed those two reports fleshing out their case after they read these Evidentiary Objections which called their previous expert reports conclusory and therefore not usable. We are only getting to read this redacted version now, but SCO got the original some time ago.

Improper Use of SCO v. IBM Deposition Testimony

Novell also charges SCO with trying to use depositions from the IBM case, but Novell wasn't in attendance at those depositions, so that is improper, it says:

Federal Rule of Civil Procedure 32(a) provides '[a]t the trial or upon hearing of a motion or an interlocutory proceeding, any part or all of a deposition, so far as admissible under the rules of evidence applied as though the witness were then present and testifying, may be used against any party who was present or represented at the taking of the deposition or who had reasonable notice thereof.' (emphasis added.) this rule 'impliedly prohibits the use of a deposition against any party who was not present or represented at the taking of such deposition or who had no reasonable notice thereof.' Hewitt v. Huttler.... Here, SCO is attempting to use four SCO v. IBM deposition transcripts against Novell, who was not a party to that litigation, was not present for those depositions, and had no notice of them.

You can see why you'd want a rule like that, in that you'd naturally want to be able to question the deposed person yourself in the context of the new litigation. Here's 32(a), if you'd like to verify.

Improper Authentication

This came up last time, but it's quite amazing to me that Novell says that SCO has offered "unsigned letters and agreements" as if that could ever be evidence. The rule here is 901. Novell quotes this part:

The requirement of authentication or identification as a condition precedent to admissibility is satisfied by evidence sufficient to support a finding that the matter in question is what its proponent claims.

I'm sure you can figure out what the opposite of that would be. How would you ever know if a document was real or made up, if there were no rules regarding authentication? It's not that you can never offer an unsigned document, by the way, but you certainly have to demonstrate its authenticity somehow. For example, the rule explains that you could offer testimony. Like with a will, let's say the signed original is lost. You could have the witnesses who signed it the day it was executed come forward with testimony that a Xerox copy of the will even though it isn't signed or dated by the decedent is identical to the original that the witnesses signed. What you can't do is just throw it in the pot and call it good when there is no authentication.

What didn't SCO authenticate? I see that, for one, it attached an unsigned December 2003 "Letter to Linux Users" as Exhibit 47. How would one know if the signed ones read the same? There are other issues with it Novell lists, like hearsay and best evidence rule, of course.

Untimeliness

There was a court deadline, and SCO missed it. "Evidence submitted after a court-imposed filing deadline must not be considered absent a showing of good cause," Novell points out, and from the cases cited, I think they are referring to expert reports. "We wanted to sandbag Novell" won't fly as good cause.

Improper Use of Settlement Evidence

This section is so highly redacted, I can only guess from a case Novell mentions that it is referring to something in a settlement or settlement discussions with a third party. There must be a story there, but I don't yet know what it is. This is a bookmark, then, to remember that later if more details come out, this is where they go. [ Update: Dr Stupid believes he has it figured out, and I think he is right, that it likely refers to the settlement of the dispute between Novell and Santa Cruz over the 1996 IBM buyout, the dispute which ended in Amendment X.]

The general rule, 408, is that parties to litigation should be able to speak freely in settlement negotiations, which are typical in litigation in the beginning and often when one side notices it is going to get massacred if it goes forward, typically after a ruling goes against them or after summary judgment motions do. But it many times can happen too that the negotiations ultimately don't work out, and it's back to the litigation battle, and neither side is supposed to use certain things revealed in those settlement talks. For example, you can't say, "The other side offered us beellions of dollars in settlement talks, so they must know they are guilty." You can understand why. If there was no such rule, no one would ever try to negotiate a settlement, and that's against everyone's best interest. Here's how Federal Rule of Evidence 408 reads:

Rule 408. Compromise and Offers to Compromise

(a) Prohibited uses.— Evidence of the following is not admissible on behalf of any party, when offered to prove liability for, invalidity of, or amount of a claim that was disputed as to validity or amount, or to impeach through a prior inconsistent statement or contradiction:

(1) furnishing or offering or promising to furnish or accepting or offering or promising to accept a valuable consideration in compromising or attempting to compromise the claim; and

(2) conduct or statements made in compromise negotiations regarding the claim, except when offered in a criminal case and the negotiations related to a claim by a public office or agency in the exercise of regulatory, investigative, or enforcement authority.

Permitted uses. This rule does not require exclusion if the evidence is offered for purposes not prohibited by subdivision (a). Examples of permissible purposes include proving a witness's bias or prejudice ; negating a contention of undue delay; and proving an effort to obstruct a criminal investigation or prosecution.

Improper Use of Withheld Discovery

We know about this topic from the IBM case, where the Federal Rule of Civil Procedure 37 came into play in a big way. It's the rule that says if you don't play by the discovery rules, you can't use withheld discovery materials at trial or in summary judgment motions. Novell cites in particular 37(d):

(d) Failure of Party to Attend at Own Deposition or Serve Answers to Interrogatories or Respond to Request for Inspection.

If a party or an officer, director, or managing agent of a party or a person designated under Rule 30(b)(6) or 31(a) to testify on behalf of a party fails (1) to appear before the officer who is to take the deposition, after being served with a proper notice, or (2) to serve answers or objections to interrogatories submitted under Rule 33, after proper service of the interrogatories, or (3) to serve a written response to a request for inspection submitted under Rule 34, after proper service of the request, the court in which the action is pending on motion may make such orders in regard to the failure as are just, and among others it may take any action authorized under subparagraphs (A), (B), and (C) of subdivision (b)(2) of this rule. Any motion specifying a failure under clause (2) or (3) of this subdivision shall include a certification that the movant has in good faith conferred or attempted to confer with the party failing to answer or respond in an effort to obtain such answer or response without court action. In lieu of any order or in addition thereto, the court shall require the party failing to act or the attorney advising that party or both to pay the reasonable expenses, including attorney's fees, caused by the failure unless the court finds that the failure was substantially justified or that other circumstances make an award of expenses unjust.

The failure to act described in this subdivision may not be excused on the ground that the discovery sought is objectionable unless the party failing to act has a pending motion for a protective order as provided by Rule 26(c).

What is the withheld discovery here? Do you remember reading the emails back and forth about whether SCO would answer Interrogatory 15? They finally did, but this time it's about Novell's Interrogatory 9, and Novell says SCO is offering as evidence materials it never mentioned before, as it should have, in response to that Interrogatory:

Federal Rule of Civil Procedure 37 bars the use of certain withheld evidence at trial or on summary judgment. Specifically, Rule 37(d) states that if a party fails "to serve answers or objections to interrogatories submitted under Rule 33 after proper service of the interrogatories . . . the court. . . may make such orders in regard to the failure as are just," including excluding that evidence at trial. Novell asked SCO in its Interrogatories to "state all facts, evidence, and bases" in support of their allegation that the parties intended the APA to transfer the copyrights, for example. (Second Supplemental Declaraton of Kenneth Brakebill... Ex. 10, Interrogatory No. 9.) SCO's response did not identify certain documents which it has included as Exhibits to the James Declaration here and relied upon as evidence of the parties' intention in the APA. Accordingly, under Rule 37, SCO should not be permitted to rely upon those documents now....

In addition, under the Federal Rules of Procedure 30(b)(6), SCO had a duty to designate persons to testify on its behalf "as to matters known or reasonably available to the organization." For example, SCO designated Erik Hughes as its witness on the topic of damages, including potential lost SCOsource customers, who testified at page 30 of Exhibit 65:

Q: Does SCO know of any other companies that it contends declined a SCOsource license and cited Novell as a reason?

Ms. BACH BORUCHOW: Objection.

THE WITNESS: I don't know of any other companies that SCO is aware of that they haven't made available.

Nowhere in that deposition does the witness identify Dell as a potential SCOsource customer, much less one that declined a license because of Novell. Yet a subsequent (and recent) declaration of SCO's CEO, Darl McBride, is replete with statements regarding SCO's knowledge of Dell's SCOsource intentions. This improperly withheld information should therefore be excluded.

Novell lists some other cited materials it also objects to on the same grounds, like Santa Cruz's long-ago EU complaint against Microsoft and a deposition transcript of Joseph LaSala, Exhibit 40. Also SCO has offered some correspondence with Merrill Lynch, which Novell also objects to citing the hearsay rule.

All the Rest

And Novell objects to the deposition transcript dated 10/6/04 of Larry Gasparro, Exhibit 56, on the grounds of lack of personal knowledge and hearsay. Well, double hearsay actually. And further the testimony by Gasparro was from the IBM case, so it's not proper either. I wonder. Couldn't they get Gasparro to agree to be deposed again? The depositions of Gregory Pettit, Phillip Langer, Ed Chatlos and Duff Thompson, Exhibits 57, 58, 68 and 69, and two from Ryan Tibbits, Exhibits 59 and 63, are also objected to on similar grounds. Novell objects to the deposition transcripts of Chris Sontag, all three of them (3/14/07, 4/30/07 and 5/18/07, Exhibits 60, 64, and 80) on the additional ground of relevance. He throughout his testimony, Novell writes, and without foundation, "offers inadmissible speculation."

That is the SCO hallmark, as far as I'm concerned. And indeed Novell cites the same issue of inadmissible speculation with Darl McBride's declaration and deposition testimony, Exhibits 61 and 81. Worse yet, Novell says that his declaration "shows that SCO knew of the information it withheld during its 30(b)(6) deposition at the time of that deposition." Uh oh.

There are also objections to Jeff Hunsaker's deposition, Exhibit 62, where Novell charges that there was no evidence presented that he was ever in direct communications with any of the potential licensees he testifies about. Or speculates about, Novell calls it. Further objections are listed to Erik Hughes' deposition transcript, Exhibit 65 and to Blake Stowell's, Exhibit 67, which Novell says SCO neglected to mention in any of its briefs but attached anyway. That makes it irrelevant and it "wastes time" among other things.

Gary Pisano's and Paul Moxley's Declarations, Exhibits 71 and 72, were filed too late. They should have been attached to the summary judgment record with service of SCO's May 18 briefs or SCO should have asked permission of the court by means of a 56(f) motion. It didn't do either, so Novell says they should be excluded. Ditto Evan Ivie's Declaration, Exhibit 73, and Thomas Cargill's Exhibit 74 and Christine Botosan's, Exhibit 87.

Novell objects to the 1996 SCO Annual Report being entered into evidence on the parol evidence rule, in that SCO is trying to use it to contradict the "plain language of the APA". SCO also failed to mention this document in discovery, and it's too late now. Ditto on an FTC form and notification and a 1987 MS Agreement Memorandum, a Notification and Report form, a Project Sleigh Ride presentation, a Just Sports letter, whatever these are. Sandeep Gupta's latest creative writings, a May 18 declaration, Exhibit 89, is also inadmissible parol evidence Novell says, hearsay, and he has no personal knowledge of the matters he is testifying about, according to Novell. For example, how would he know the actions or intents of Novell engineers or the UnixWare MR Review Board? In any case, it's too late, being also in the category of withheld testimony on Novell's list. Apparently Ralph Yarro offered a declaration, dated May 17, but Novell wants it tossed on relevance, lack of personal knowledge, hearsay and best evidence rules. Oh, and oopsie. SCO forgot to cite it in any of its memoranda. Even if it had, it's too late now. Ditto with some Skip Jonas email, whoever that is, who tries to testify to the intent of the APA, but without any evidence he was ever involved in any way. There is also a Larry Bouffard email, Exhibit 93, and an exhibit referencing someone with the last name Ackerman, Exhibit 94, in email discussion apparently with Jonas.

Exhibit 103 is a Department of Justice letter of some kind Novell also objects to. Novell cites the Copyright Act, which requires a written instrument of conveyance, not a letter from an outside party regarding intent. It's too late also. And so is the IP Assignment and the Troy Keller Declaration, too late. In any case, Mr. Keller's opining on the APA and Amendment 2 isn't based on any evidence he was involved in either. The Novell letters are also too late. As for Lee Johnson's declaration, maybe the least said about it, the better. The grounds are lack of personal knowledge, hearsay, and relevance from this nonlawyer whose testimony, Novell says, "is replete with inadmissible speculation as to the actions, thoughts, and motivations of David Bradford..." I'd call that a polite description, myself. "In addition, Mr. Johnson admits that he is not a lawyer, but instead a "businessman and investor" who has held SCO stock...; accordingly his inferences about the legal effect of Mr. Bradford's alleged statements are without foundation."

Jay Petersen's declaration is also objected to on the grounds he "improperly speculates as to the actions and intentions of SCO, Novell, and Mr. McKenna (stating without foundation... that 'SCO did not add "Novell" copyright notices to any of its source products." In any case, he is factually wrong, Novell notes:

Mr. Petersen's lack of personal knowledge is confirmed by the fact that his account of the supposed rationale behind the continued presence of Novell on the copyright notices -- that Novell appeared on the copyright notices because Novell's NetWare code to which Novell owned the copyrights appeared in some subdirectories on the CDs containing the new releases of UnixWare -- does not make sense. The NetWare directories already contained copyright notices listing only Novell.... Moreover, Santa Cruz's UnixWare Release 2.1 and 2.1.3 contained copyright notices for numerous third parties other than Santa Cruz or Novell in various subdirectories.... Yet, none of those third parties were listed in the copyright notice for the main installation directory; only Novell and Santa Cruz were listed. Accordingly Mr. Peterson's declaration should be stricken in its entirety.

It's also, Novell says, too late. As for Steve Sabbath's new testimony, "As demonstrated by his lack of memory, Mr. Sabbath's testimony is based solely on the inadmissible out-of-court statements of those who were actually involved with the negotiations." That means it's hearsay.

That brings us to the late expert report by G. Gervaise Davis. Aside from being too late, he "is not qualified as an expert on any matter in this case, including bankruptcy or 365(n) issues, and his proffered testimony lacks the requisite foundation for admissibility on summary judgment. Specifically, Mr. Davis fails to cite any document he reviewed, or any familiarity with the issues on which he is opining. As a result, his declaration is filled with speculation (stating without foundation at paragraph 6(e), for example, that 'it would not have been logical or necessary for legal counsel to Novell to rely on' certain concerns). Not only can Mr. Davis have no knowledge as to Novell's state of mind, it is unclear that he even reviewed relevant evidence." Remember Federal Rule of Evidence 701, 702 and Federal Rule of Civil Procedure 56(e)? Novell cites all three and asks that his testimony be stricken. They want it all stricken, in fact.

I am guessing that the new SCO lawyers did some work, simply desperate to survive this season of summary judgments, but alas! perchance too late for much of its evidence. They had to know Novell would object. They know the Federal Rules of Evidence too, after all. They teach that in law schools everywhere. But at this point, what do they have to lose? Other than our high regard, and I've seen no evidence *that* keeps any of them up at night.

If the judge were to go along with these objections to any significant degree, Novell would ace the summary judgment portion of this litigation in a very big way as far as its own motions go. Like totally. I can't predict because we are seeing only Novell's side; SCO's is sealed. That could be from mortification or many other more legitimate reasons. I'll opine, since no one but Novell seems to care about the rules of evidence and speculation is in the air everywhere, that this fear of not surviving summary judgment is what is driving this last-minute barrage of SCO "evidence" and that perhaps its intended audience is not just the judge. The parts that can't fly might have something to do with the public, where this case has always been tried by SCO in parallel to its efforts in the courtroom. The public might not know the rules of evidence, but the judge does. And I was joking. He does care about things like speculation, hearsay, timeliness, and all the rules of the road. That's his job.

If evidentiary objections are of interest and you'd like to understand the topic better, here's an article by a lawyer who explains it simply and clearly, although in the context of a trial. And yes, SCO can answer. Here's an example of an answer [PDF] to evidentiary objections [PDF] in another case, just so you see what an answer would look like. And as you probably have guessed, this all matters a great deal in any appeal, because it establishes a record, assuming that Novell presses for a ruling from Judge Kimball on each objection. And evidentiary objections just means objections to the substance of the question or testimony, as opposed to procedural objections, which are about method. People write entire books on the subject of discovery, by the way, and of course Google Books can point you to some.


  


New Novell Evidentiary Objections to SCO's May 18 Filings and Exhibits - Updated | 317 comments | Create New Account
Comments belong to whoever posts them. Please notify us of inappropriate comments.
Errors here
Authored by: lordshipmayhem on Saturday, June 09 2007 @ 02:28 PM EDT
Please put nature of error in the title

[ Reply to This | # ]

Off topic here
Authored by: lordshipmayhem on Saturday, June 09 2007 @ 02:30 PM EDT
Please make all links clickable!!

[ Reply to This | # ]

Knowledge of Federal Rules of Evidence
Authored by: lordshipmayhem on Saturday, June 09 2007 @ 02:39 PM EDT
"They know the Federal Rules of Evidence too, after all. They teach that in
law schools everywhere."

I was wondering, based on BSF's performance to date, if they WERE aware. Does
"law schools everywhere" include the Box of Cracker Jacks Law School,
that many of BSF's legal eagles seem to be graduates of?

[ Reply to This | # ]

Compromise
Authored by: JamesK on Saturday, June 09 2007 @ 03:03 PM EDT
"You may hope that the penalty is that the lawyers are marched out and shot
at dawn. No. Nothing like that happens."

I'd settle for hung at sun down. ;-)


---
Let me know if you don't receive this message.

[ Reply to This | # ]

  • Disbarment - Authored by: Anonymous on Saturday, June 09 2007 @ 03:20 PM EDT
    • Disbarment - Authored by: jmc on Saturday, June 09 2007 @ 04:25 PM EDT
  • Compromise - Authored by: BobDowling on Saturday, June 09 2007 @ 05:38 PM EDT
  • Compromise - Authored by: Anonymous on Sunday, June 10 2007 @ 01:17 AM EDT
    • Compromise - Authored by: Anonymous on Sunday, June 10 2007 @ 06:07 AM EDT
    • Compromise - Authored by: Anonymous on Sunday, June 10 2007 @ 06:22 AM EDT
      • Compromise - Authored by: Anonymous on Sunday, June 10 2007 @ 09:40 PM EDT
    • Compromise - Authored by: JamesK on Sunday, June 10 2007 @ 07:46 AM EDT
  • Compromise - Authored by: elderlycynic on Sunday, June 10 2007 @ 05:07 AM EDT
I see why!
Authored by: Anonymous on Saturday, June 09 2007 @ 03:10 PM EDT
I see why its called a law practice now. They just keep doing the same thing
over and over again. Must be like keyboard practice.

[ Reply to This | # ]

What are the procedural rules for this "objection"?
Authored by: Laomedon on Saturday, June 09 2007 @ 03:20 PM EDT
Is it treated like a motion, with opposition and reply memos?

[ Reply to This | # ]

To save time, I have here the reports from the hearings
Authored by: Anonymous on Saturday, June 09 2007 @ 03:23 PM EDT
I happen to have available, the reports for the hearings for this particular
motion:

Judge K: hello and welcome

SCO : helllooo ... blah blah blah, unfair balh blah blah

Novell: Out of time/order/mind blah blah blah

Judge K: I'll take it under advisement, I'll get back to you soon. Don't call
me, I'll call you.

[ Reply to This | # ]

New Novell Evidentiary Objections to SCO's May 18 Filings and Exhibits
Authored by: tredman on Saturday, June 09 2007 @ 03:28 PM EDT
"I can't predict because we are seeing only Novell's side; SCO's is sealed.
That could be from mortification or many other more legitimate reasons."

Did anybody else see the subtle, and maybe unintended, humor in this? The old
school, secretive, proprietary method going up against one more open and
transparent? I don't know about anybody else, but that pretty much paints the
picture on both the IBM and Novell litigation and speaks volumes about the value
of open _________. Source, standards, processes...you fill in the blank.

---
Tim
"I drank what?" - Socrates, 399 BCE

[ Reply to This | # ]

Improper use of settlement evidence: does that apply to BSD?
Authored by: xtifr on Saturday, June 09 2007 @ 04:19 PM EDT

Huh, the "proper use of settlement evidence" is a curious one, though it makes sense as presented. But I have to wonder: is this why we haven't seen more arguments based on the BSD case? After all, the settlement itself was sealed, and only ended up in the public record because one of the participants turned out to be subject to the Freedom of Information Act. Maybe that's not enough to make it admissible? The interesting thing is that both sides in this case claim to be effectively the same side in that case, i.e. USL.

So I suppose my question for the legal experts in the house is: would this rule apply to the actual terms of a settlement? Or is only for the records from any negotiations intended to lead to a settlement? And if the former, does it matter whether the settlement was public or private, and if so, does it matter how the settlement became public? The relevance of these questions, not just to the existing cases, but others in the free software community who may contemplate suing or being sued by SCO (or Novell, for that matter), should be obvious.

---
Do not meddle in the affairs of Wizards, for it makes them soggy and hard to light.

[ Reply to This | # ]

Do I see a pattern?
Authored by: mobrien_12 on Saturday, June 09 2007 @ 04:25 PM EDT
In all the lawsuits SCOG is involved in, I think I see a pattern.

SCOG runs around saying how terribly wronged they were and tells stories that
sound like some sort of great conspiracy theory to destroy them, but when it
comes time for it, they fail to give evidence and specifics, just stories and
bluster.

The people SCOG sue say that SCOG repeatedly screws up, is not specific, have no
case, and fails to meet deadlines.

And the judges take an eternity to put an end to this foolishness.

[ Reply to This | # ]

Abuse of the English Language
Authored by: Anonymous on Saturday, June 09 2007 @ 04:42 PM EDT
PJ says:
What the penalty can be is that you don't get to use the evidence, because of your improper conduct, and that can mean you lose your motion or your case.
I realize that lawyers use a professional jargon, and words really don't mean what they mean in everyday English. But this really is a huge departure from the everyday definition of 'penalty'. A penalty is a punishment, or a disadvantage, or something bad happening. What PJ describes is merely the lack of an advantage; an advantage you wouldn't get anyway if you were to play by the rules.

Certainly having a direct consequence of losing the case would be a penalty, but if that all flows secondarily from not getting to use improper evidence, then them's the breaks. Actual penalties would be money fines, or jail time or disbarment. If something like that happens, then I'll call it a penalty.

[ Reply to This | # ]

But But But
Authored by: Anonymous on Saturday, June 09 2007 @ 04:54 PM EDT
"know some of you are saying, "It is about time somebody told the
court what they do." You may hope that the penalty is that the lawyers are
marched out and shot at dawn. No. Nothing like that happens. But there certainly
can be a penalty. What the penalty can be is that you don't get to use the
evidence, because of your improper conduct, and that can mean you lose your
motion or your case."

Pray tell, shouldn't there also be penalties beyond that?
When on eparty si squarely behind or toeing the line, the other party is
standing 2 yards beyond the line, every time. At some point, cannot the referee
tell this player to taek 5 minutes out, forfeit his sneakers, go to jail, etc.
Instead of just telling them to get back to the line? If it was acceptabel to
repeatedly step over the line, why should anyonew then bother staying behind the
line. If there are no serious sanctions to stepping over the line, then teh
correct strategy fro any litigant shoudl be to always stepo ovrf the line,
becuase now and they you'd not get cvaught at it, win big, and the rest of the
time you'd suffer no adverse effect.

I believe Magistrate Wells already expressed some such opinion, after SCO
requested for yet another extension for adding stuff to their final disclosuers.
She said something to the effect that if she allowed SCO's motion, a reversal of
her 3 prior court orders, what would then be the point of having court orders?

If you have a dollar, and you cheat when trying to get another 10 cents, you
should lose some of your dollar, not just the 10 cents. Otherwise we'll all just
cheat, because it is the optimal thing to do in the long run.

[ Reply to This | # ]

No penalties here
Authored by: baomike on Saturday, June 09 2007 @ 04:56 PM EDT
<<But there certainly can be a penalty. What the penalty can be is that
you don't get to use the evidence, because of your improper conduct, and that
can mean you lose your motion or your case>>
This assumes it matters ( the winning). This is like threatening a man on the
gallows with a year in jail for perjury.

[ Reply to This | # ]

Nothing to lose
Authored by: MeinZy on Saturday, June 09 2007 @ 05:05 PM EDT
"But there certainly can be a penalty. What the penalty can be is that you don't get to use the evidence, because of your improper conduct, and that can mean you lose your motion or your case."

That is not a penalty if your motions were doomed anyway without underhanded tactics. It's not even a slap on the wrist. I'm certain SCO's lawyers will simply conclude it was worth the try. No big deal.

---
Zy

[ Reply to This | # ]

SCO delays are now Microsoft's main weapon
Authored by: Anonymous on Saturday, June 09 2007 @ 05:06 PM EDT

OK, Microsoft comes to you and says, "you need to make yourself righteous
with our patents. We can keep you in court for years, and we don't need any
evidence." The fruits are now being harvested.

What a farce.

[ Reply to This | # ]

More Bad Lawyering on the SCO side
Authored by: kawabago on Saturday, June 09 2007 @ 05:56 PM EDT
Doesn't Boies Schiller know that SCO will turn around and sue them for
inadequate representation when this is all over?

[ Reply to This | # ]

Some folks can waltz, but they can't tango...
Authored by: Anonymous on Saturday, June 09 2007 @ 05:57 PM EDT
...and all SCO has is a hammer, so they think everything looks like a nail.

[ Reply to This | # ]

Expert witnesses
Authored by: Anonymous on Saturday, June 09 2007 @ 06:55 PM EDT
This goes a long way to helping me understand about my roll in a case in which I
was to be an expert witness. I am a BSEE programmer who had worked extensively
on several versions of the system under litigation.

I had contributed significant work to the system, and was on one side. On the
other side was a PhD MIT graduate with experience that impressed me very much.
But he didn't know the software type involved (database systems) or anything
about the specific product at all.

I had only thought it was because of the size of the credentials, and
experience, but I see from the rules mentioned that my experience on working on
the system but lack of deep software and computer education might have worked
against me, though I was expert in the system in question.

[ Reply to This | # ]

Funny Little Thing
Authored by: sproggit on Saturday, June 09 2007 @ 07:07 PM EDT
Out of idle curiosity rather than the expectation of finding anything of
significant interest, I made a relatively quick scan of the BSF web site.

Funny old thing, no mention of this case.

There are discussions of certain on-going court cases with which they are
involved, but neither these pages nor the site search engine returned anything
relating to IBM or Novell.

Now I do accept that BSF are now a huge law firm with offices all across the US.
I also concede that they must be involved in quite a few cases along the way.

But you would think, wouldn't you, that they might want to casually mention a $5
Billion law suit. Surely that's worth mentioning somewhere, right? Something
like: "We are prosecuting a $5 Billion claim against IBM for non-Literal
Copying and Method and Concept infringement" perhaps?

Ah yes, I see your point.

I've speculated before that the reason that SCO are sticking to their guns is
simply that if they back down now, their Directors would be in a world of
trouble and could easily face serious charges themselves. I wonder - I have no
legal experience to base a view on - if the strategists at BSF find themselves
in a similar situation. It's too late for them to stand before the Judge now and
ask for new counsel to be assiged. The moment they signed that multi-million
dollar deal with SCO they were effectively joined at the hip. Their fates were
sealed, or at the least, were inextricably linked.


I know this is a bit of a silly notion, but it almost seems to me as though BSF
are trying to lose this case. The only thing is, they are doing so very
carefully. I don't think they're worried about Darl, as PJ has already said. I
think they are much more concerned about their own professional reputation and
their own skins.

So... absurd discussion point, I know, but...

If you were a BSF strategist and had recently realised that you were embroiled
in 2 cases that were, to borrow an expression, going to Hell in a hand cart,
what would you do in order to wriggle out of them?

Next, how does your answer to the above question square away with what we are
seeing from them at the moment???

[ Reply to This | # ]

New Novell Evidentiary Objections to SCO's May 18 Filings and Exhibits
Authored by: Anonymous on Saturday, June 09 2007 @ 09:52 PM EDT

I know some of you are saying, "It is about time somebody told the court what they do." You may hope that the penalty is that the lawyers are marched out and shot at dawn. No. Nothing like that happens. But there certainly can be a penalty. What the penalty can be is that you don't get to use the evidence, because of your improper conduct, and that can mean you lose your motion or your case.

Sorry PJ this is is not a penalty. Should every day I attempt to steal a car. It is not a penalty to simply give the car back if caught on that day.

PJ. Sorry to be so blunt. But your time as a paralegal seems to have twisted your perspective of the fundamental difference between right and wrong. If a lawyer tells a lie, it is still a lie. If a lawyer takes part in a crimal undertaking, he is a crimal.

[ Reply to This | # ]

SCO: We can cheat more times, in more ways, than you can catch us
Authored by: vb on Saturday, June 09 2007 @ 11:17 PM EDT

I've seen this behavior in sports. The idea is to cheat so often, in so many
different ways, in such big ways - that a slew of little cheats go unnoticed and
unpunished.

They act as if "the rules don't apply to us", but what they're really
doing is creating distractions enough to slip by what seem to be infractions
that are too small to make a difference.

I think what needs to be searched for in the SCO cases is infractions that seem
too small to make a difference (today), but are (as we learn later) significant
matters.

[ Reply to This | # ]

blue cheese
Authored by: sumzero on Sunday, June 10 2007 @ 01:51 AM EDT
'They can't just say, "It's my expert opinion that the moon is made of blue
cheese. It is true, because I say so and I'm an expert."'

this made me smile. i always enjoy when you respond to or elaborate on posters'
comments in the articles themselves.

sum.zero

---
48. The best book on programming for the layman is "alice in wonderland"; but
that's because it's the best book on anything for the layman.

alan j perlis

[ Reply to This | # ]

Objections to SCO's late, irrelevant, parol, hearsaid, withheld and second-best evidence
Authored by: webster on Sunday, June 10 2007 @ 03:19 AM EDT
..
1. Thanks to PJ for the article. It's easy to take them for granted, but
analyzing the pleadings, putting them in context and explaining the whole and
parts is an invaluable service. PJ makes it simple, adds some wit and rubs part
of it in. It makes one want to read the memo, --legal reading, willingly! She
helps us appreciate the lawyers without doing the digging.

2. These objections to the evidence really knock SCO back. Instead of just
arguing about the summary judgments, SCO has to win the evidenciary arguments
just to stay in the ball game. With the evidence called into question, even if
the judge doesn't exclude it, he is likely to give it less weight. The judge
can admit it but then discredit it. It makes it easier for him to grant the
summary judgment and cite the faulty evidence, which he considered, as one of
the reasons. There is less to appeal, too.

3. Seeing such evidentiary objections outside of a hearing or discovery process
is unfamiliar. So why is SCO backloading like this? They are desperate, they
don't have copyrights, they are thinking things up as they prepare for motions
and trial, and the stakes are immense, --this case and IBM. If things go badly,
who knows how far IBM will take it. Who knows what Novell will do for a price?

4. Novell even attacks the expert submissions. They have to set forth the
relevant facts and theory that form the basis for their conclusions. It is
impossible for them to specifically address the fact of copyrights on the
excluded assets list and meaningfully conclude the opposite. That's why they
don't supply a sufficient basis for their opinions. p. 6.

5. Footnote 4 on p. 10, "withheld discovery." What worse place to
have this issue, in front of the same judges handling the IBM case where SCO has
been found to withhold specifics and expert material. More of the same will not
be surprising.

6. The litany of exhibits and objections thereto just emphasizes that SCO's
position didn't exist until years after the fact. They are straining to change
history. Everyone lived by the Novell view. So hearsay, double hearsay, parol
evidence by those who lack personal knowledge, and the second-best evidence rule
is the best they can do. SCO will have to cite cases showing all these
objections don't apply or that there are exceptions.

7. The Motion is detailed, exhaustive and clever. At first blush, SCO's pile
seemed to keep them afloat. This motion highlights the crucial copyright
issues. It is a great weakness for SCO. This suit was nelver meant to be
tried. It was just window dressing for IBM. SCO filed it as a screwy slander
of title claim. Kimball could have tossed it, but must have had IBM in his
landscape.

8. Each day without action must be a great relief to SCO. The judge could drop
a bomb at any time, but he wants all the cards dealt. He will absorb it all .

9. It is clear that the SCOSource licensing campaign has failed, as has its
supporting SCO litigation campaign. The Monopoly has taken to rattling their
patents and picking off Linux companies themselves. They are now pushing the
lies of interoperability, collaboration and standards while keeping all of those
concepts impossible if not difficult. The Monopoly has pervasive influence and
thier ill-gotten billions to maintain it. They seem to have stumbled with SCO.
Maybe IBM will sting them back.

---
webster

[ Reply to This | # ]

If BSF and SCO had wanted to play fair....
Authored by: crs17 on Sunday, June 10 2007 @ 04:58 AM EDT
I'm curious as to what method should have been used for these depositions. With
IBM and Novell on different schedules, could SCO have said to the two courts:
"We want to depose person A for both of these cases. Thus we propose at
<date and place> that all three legal groups meet to attend the
deposition." Is this type of thing done? Would the appropriate
flexibility been allowed to take the deposition at a time when one of the cases
wasn't really ready for depositions yet?

[ Reply to This | # ]

The reason why this case is what it is
Authored by: Anonymous on Sunday, June 10 2007 @ 07:34 AM EDT
When looking at the details it's easy to miss the larger picture. So why would
SCO do something that didn't work in the IBM-case either?

Well, for SCO it *worked*!

The SCO folks know they can't win this case. There's too many hurdles and SCO
probably won't make even one of them. But SCO managed to evade *any* of the
critical questions to date and has done so for years. It's all about buying
time, because as long as they still control SCO they can play their funny stock
games and make big money. So they'll play this game till all their assets are
gone, else it'd just go to Novell and SCO surely doesn't want *that*.

So there *shoud* be a way to get compensation from lawyers participating in such
a scheme.

[ Reply to This | # ]

Why exclusion of evidence is not punishment
Authored by: Anonymous on Sunday, June 10 2007 @ 08:00 AM EDT
Very simply, it is a result that should have happened anyway. If the submitting
party had followed the rules, the excluded evidence would not have been usable
because it would not have been submitted. If that means that the submitting
party ultimately loses his case, he should have lost anyway. These are not
consequences of bad behavior, but of having been in the wrong regardless of
behavior.

What people are asking is that apparent deliberate flouting of the rules be
punished. That requires more than just applying the rules. Either the lawyers
are trying to fool the judge, or they don't know enough to be lawyers.

[ Reply to This | # ]

Ackermann, possibly?
Authored by: The Cornishman on Sunday, June 10 2007 @ 08:48 AM EDT
someone with the last name Ackerman, Exhibit 94
Oh, no. If SCO has worked out a way of feeding one lawsuit back into the inputs of another one, there is literally no knowing when this might end. You guys need a new FRCP, pronto.

Yes, OK:- </humour>

---
(c) assigned to PJ

[ Reply to This | # ]

New Novell Evidentiary Objections to SCO's May 18 Filings and Exhibits
Authored by: Anonymous on Sunday, June 10 2007 @ 11:39 AM EDT
Then they are merely suborning perjury.

Wikipedia Link

[ Reply to This | # ]

New Novell Evidentiary Objections to SCO's May 18 Filings and Exhibits - Updated
Authored by: boojumbunn on Monday, June 11 2007 @ 10:16 AM EDT
I must admit, all the late filings and preceedural errors seems odd in a law
firm. Is it possible that this behavior is deliberate for PR and future
business?

It seems to me that having the ability to make a press announcement saying
"We would have won but the court threw out 2/3 of our evidence due to
technicalities." would be nice for SCO. Also, if you can show that a bunch
of your evidence was not used for a case, would that allow them to ask for
another trial based on the evidence that wasn't let in on this trial? It seems
unfair if thats the case.

Boojum the brown bunny

[ Reply to This | # ]

New Novell Evidentiary Objections to SCO's May 18 Filings and Exhibits - Updated
Authored by: tanner andrews on Wednesday, June 13 2007 @ 08:01 AM EDT
this fear of not surviving summary judgment is what is driving this last-minute barrage of SCO "evidence" and that perhaps its intended audience is not just the judge.

Right in one guess. It is helpful to feed this stuff to the public. However, the goal is to get this stuff into the record on appeal (ROA) as well. Assume always that SCO plans to survive something until the appeal.

Summary judgment is properly granted where there are no material facts in dispute and the moving party is entitled to judgment as a matter of law. You defeat a summary judgment by showing either material facts in dispute or lack of entitlement as a matter of law.

On appeal, SCO wants to argue that there were material facts in dispute, citing to ROA-nn, where nn are the page numbers of all this late-manufactured ``evidence''. It is possible that Novell will argue that the material was improperly submitted, &c., but SCO will have the page numbers to cite.

Let there be no doubt: if there is an appeal, SCO will happly cite anything and everything for which their lawyers can keep straight faces. I would say that SCO's lawyers are pretty good at doing keeping straight faces while presenting the most implausible material.

I cannot say how gullible the 10th circuit panel will prove to be. SCO might get lucky.

---
I am not your lawyer; please ignore above message.

[ Reply to This | # ]

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